[EN] Posting (or double-posting) in multiple languages? Read this!/[ES] ¿Publicar (o publicar doble) en varios idiomas? ¡Lee esto!

10개월 전

Spanish translation is available below.
La traducción de este texto está disponible más abajo.

From time to time, users see that their posts are being down-voted with the comment "Copying and pasting previous posts or significant parts there of could be seen as spam" by @steemcleaners. For the Spanish-speaking communities in particular, this is often (but not always) because the author has done something which is considered abuse by the community, this is;

Posting identical content in two different posts, where the only difference is languages (for example one in English and one in Spanish) is not acceptable.

This is not something I say, nor is it my rule, this is not something I made up. It is simply common sense and good behaviour for the STEEM blockchain and the STEEM community. The @steemcleaners - who are the ones fighting abuse on this platform - consider this double-posting behaviour to be spam, vote-farming, and abuse of the reward pool.

This is not something new. It has never been ok to post identical content several times. But now, more users are starting to realize the great impact that this has on the daily reward pool that we all share and try to do something about it.


When you post the same content twice, you - the author - are seen as trying to get rewards from the reward pool twice. The same reward pool we all share.

Ask yourself this:

Is it ok that a user who happens to know ten different languages, posts the same content ten times?
Is it ok that a user who knows how to use Google translate (which in most cases is terrible, by the way), translates the same content ten times and posts ten times? How about 20? Or 50?

The answer to those questions is, no, it is not ok. And if it's not ok to do it ten times, it's not ok to do it twice.

When you do this, you will eventually be reported to @steemcleaners by someone else in the community, get downvoted - or even worse - put on their blacklist(s).

Another extremely important aspect of this is, that curators will notice double-posting and stop voting for that user's content. Curators talk to each other all the time, and will spread the word. If one curator notices, the others will know faster than anyone would guess.


What's the solution?

So what can you do, if you want to reach English-speaking users, as well as users who speak a different language? Many authors and content creators benefit from being able to do this, because they can reach a broader audience.

If you want to post the same content in different languages, there are two different options to consider;

1 - Have all languages/translations in the same post, just like I am doing in this post. Many, many users already do this, and it is by far the easiest and most practical option.

or

2 - Post twice, but then you should decline payout on the second, translated post.

Option 2) is slightly more complicated. If you choose option 2), to decline payout in the second post, you should put a clear note in the beginning or the end of the post. This note should ask your community/followers/readers to upvote the original first post if they like the translated version. The note should include a link to the first post, so that readers can go there and upvote that one. That way, you can get rewards from those users who may not have understood your untranslated post.

The note could look something like this:

"This post is a translation of my original post, which you will find here: (INSERT LINK TO ORIGINAL POST). If you want to upvote this content, please go and upvote THAT post. Payout for THIS post are declined."

You could also include a note in the first post, to indicate that you are going to post a translated post later (where you will decline payout).


"But it looks so ugly!"

Many users care a great deal about what their blog/feed looks like, what audience they want to engage with their content, as well as what their posts look like. And you should care! Your blog and your posts are a part of who you are on the blockchain, they are a part of how you present your content.

For example, if your content is mainly focussed on music or photography, but don't really write that much text, then option 1) is probably the best and easiest for you. If your posts have a lot of text, then option 2) might be better. Some users, who post a wide variety of content, post some content only in English, and other content only in a different language. Maybe a mix between the two options would work better for you.

I have often read users saying "But if I post with two languages in the same post, it will look ugly and be unreadable!" If you feel like this, you should consider using more markdown formatting in your post. Maybe use a different front-end than Steemit (I can recommend Steempeak), where there are many more useful tools to help you make your post look better for your audience. Design your own "separators" (or ask a friend to design one). Look at what other users do and get inspiration from them.

Ultimately, it is a choice you have to make for your blog, your content and your audience.

Just... don't double-post and expect rewards twice. It's not good for you and it's not good for the STEEM ecosystem.

Remember, abuse is not only harming other users. You yourself are also a part of this ecosystem, you yourself - together with all the other users - share the daily reward pool, which is NOT infinite.

Finally, if you have any questions or queries (even if it's just a bit of help with a separator) you can get in touch with me and I will be more than happy to help.

All of us, all of us, have made mistakes at some point, on this platform or elsewhere, most often because of our own ignorance. It is up to us to correct our mistakes and try to do better.

All of us together can make this a better place to be.

Co-authored by @nelyp and @johan.norberg


Versión en español


En algunas ocasiones, algunos usuarios ven que sus publicaciones tienen down-vote por parte de @steemcleaners por "Copiar y pegar publicaciones anteriores o partes importantes de ellas que podrían verse como spam". En particular, en el caso de las comunidades de habla hispana, esto es a menudo (aunque no siempre) porque el autor ha hecho algo muy desaconsejable por parte de la comunidad, esto es;

Publicar contenido idéntico en dos publicaciones diferentes, donde la única diferencia son los idiomas (por ejemplo, uno en inglés y otro en español), esto no es aceptable.

Esto no es algo que yo digo ni mi regla, esto no es algo que yo me inventé. Es simplemente sentido común y buen uso de la blockchain de STEEM y la comunidad STEEM. @steemcleaners, que son los responsables de combatir el abuso en esta plataforma, consideran que este comportamiento de doble publicación es spam, farmeo de votos y abuso de la piscina de recompensas.

Esto no es algo nuevo. Nunca ha estado bien publicar contenido idéntico varias veces. Lo que sí puede ser es que hasta ahora algunos no se han percatado del gran impacto que provoca en la piscina diaria de recompensas que compartimos todos.

Traducción:
Copiar y pegar publicaciones anteriores o partes importantes de las mismas podría verse como spam cuando:

  • Vuelve a publicar el mismo contenido sin contenido original adicional o cambios significativos
  • Vuelve a publicar contenido dentro de la misma ventana de pago

La comunidad desaconseja el spam y puede dar lugar a que la cuenta entre en la lista negra.

Por favor, abstenerse de copiar y pegar publicaciones anteriores en el futuro...


Cuando publicas el mismo contenido dos veces, tú, el autor, eres visto como alguien que está intentando obtener ganancias de la piscina diaria de recompensas dos veces. La misma piscina de recompensas que compartimos todos.

¿Cuál sería tu respuesta si preguntáramos esto?:

¿Estaría bien que un usuario que conoce diez idiomas diferentes publique el mismo contenido diez veces?
¿Está bien que un usuario que sabe cómo usar el traductor de Google (que en la mayoría de los casos es terrible, por cierto), traduzca el mismo contenido diez veces y publique diez veces?
¿Qué tal 20? ¿O 50?

La respuesta a esas preguntas es, no, no está bien. Y si no está bien hacerlo diez veces, no está bien hacerlo dos veces.

Cuando haces esto, en algún momento serás reportado a @steemcleaners por otro usuario de la comunidad, te darán down-vote, o peor aún, serás incluido en su lista negra.

Otro aspecto extremadamente importante es que los curadores notarán estas doble publicaciones y dejarán de votar por el contenido de ese usuario. Los curadores hablan entre ellos todo el tiempo y se correrá la voz. Si un curador se da cuenta, los demás lo sabrán más rápido de lo que cualquiera podría imaginar.


Posibles soluciones

¿Qué puedes hacer si quieres llegar a usuarios de habla inglesa, así como también a usuarios que hablan un idioma diferente? Muchos autores y creadores de contenido ya se benefician de poder hacer esto, porque pueden llegar a un público más amplio.

Si quieres publicar el mismo contenido en diferentes idiomas, hay dos opciones diferentes a considerar;

1 - Tener todos los idiomas/traducciones en la misma publicación, así como lo estoy haciendo yo en este post. Muchos, muchos usuarios ya hacen esto, y es de lejos la opción más fácil y más práctica.

o

2 - Publica dos veces, pero luego rechaza el pago en la segunda publicación, la traducida.

La opción 2) es un poco más complicada. Si eliges la opción 2), rechazar el pago en la segunda publicación, debes poner una nota clara al principio o al final de la publicación. En esa nota le pides a la comunidad/seguidores/lectores que voten por la primera publicación original si les ha gustado la versión traducida. La nota debe incluir un enlace a la primera publicación, para que los usuarios puedan ir y votar esa. De esta forma, puedes obtener recompensas de aquellos usuarios que puede que no hayan entendido la publicación no traducida.

La nota podría ser algo así:

"Esta publicación es una traducción de mi publicación original, que encontrará aquí: (INSERTAR ENLACE A LA PUBLICACIÓN ORIGINAL). Si desea votar por este contenido, por favor, vaya y vote ESA publicación del enlace anterior. El pago de ESTA publicación ha sido declinado."

También puedes incluir una nota en la primera publicación, para indicar que publicarás una segunda (publicación) traducida más tarde (donde se rechazarán las recompensas).


"¡Pero se ve tan feo!"

A muchos usuarios les importa mucho el aspecto de su blog/feed, el público al que quieren atraer con su contenido y el aspecto de sus publicaciones. ¡Y hacen bien preocupándose por eso! Tu blog y tus publicaciones son parte de quién eres en la cadena de bloques (blockchain) y de cómo presentas tu contenido.

Por ejemplo, si tu contenido se centra principalmente en música o fotografía, pero realmente no escribes tanto texto, entonces la opción 1) es probablemente la mejor y más fácil para ti. Si tus publicaciones tienen mucho texto, entonces puede que la opción 2) te vaya mejor. Algunos usuarios, que publican una amplia variedad de contenido, publican algunos posts solo en inglés y otros posts solo en un idioma diferente. O tal vez una combinación entre las dos opciones funcione mejor para ti.

Muchas veces he leído a usuarios dicendo "pero si publico en dos idiomas en la misma publicación, se verá feo y será ilegible". Si es tu caso, deberías considerar usar más formatos de maquetación en tu publicaciones. Tal vez sería mejor que uses un front-end diferente a Steemit (recomiendo mucho Steempeak), donde haya muchas más herramientas para ayudar a que tu publicación se vea más bonita para tu audiencia. Diseña tus propios "separadores" o pídele a un amigo que haga uno para ti. Mira lo que hacen otros usuarios e intenta que te llegue algo de inspiración de ellos.

En definitiva, es tu elección, es algo que debes decidir para tu blog, tu contenido y tu audiencia.

Simplemente... no publiques dos veces y esperes recompensas dos veces. No es bueno para ti y no es bueno para el ecosistema de STEEM.

Recuerda que con cualquier tipo de abuso, no solo perjudicas a otros usuarios. Tú también formas parte de este ecosistema, tú también compartes con todos los demás usuarios la piscina diaria de recompensas, que NO es infinita.

Por último, si tienes cualquier duda, consulta, ¡hasta si necesitas ayuda con los separadores que mencioné antes! - Puedes ponerte en contacto conmigo y con gusto ayudaré en todo lo que esté en mi mano.

Todos, todos, hemos cometido errores en algún momento, en esta plataforma y en cualquier otra parte, muchas veces por puro desconocimiento y está en nuestra mano corregir e intentar ser cada día mejor.

Entre todos podemos hacer de este sitio un lugar mejor.

Post en coautoría entre @nelyp y @johan.norberg.

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I disagree. The reward pool is infinite(ly divisible). The real problem is people thinking they can distinguish quality in more than one language. Even in just english, determining quality for specialized topics is quite complicated.

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Quality is subjective :)
Thanks for stopping by and commenting!

Posted using Partiko Android

Dear @nelyp

My friend @juanmolina brought me here. Interesting topic.

Posting identical content in two different posts, where the only difference is languages (for example one in English and one in Spanish) is not acceptable.

Not acceptable? I wonder by whom? Steem

Personally I think that posts which have content mixed in 2 languages will face many challenges. Major one is - the title.

If the title is mixed (like the one above) then I usually do not even bother to open. It doesn't visiually attract attention; it does look messy and unpleasent to read - actually such a title does look more like spam than real title.

1 - Have all languages/translations in the same post, just like I am doing in this post
Well. I only post in english but personally I think that user experience while reading your post (mixed 2 languages, absolutely awful title) is not what I enjoy. As a content consumer I would rather have 2 separate posts.

or even worse - put on their blacklist(s).
Any idea of what are the consequences for those who will be added to their blacklist?

Anyway what would you say about those people, who are publishing 'series' on some particular topic? You could also tell them that they should pack it all in one publication, instead of breaking one topic into 3-4 posts. Kind of nonsense, in my view.

Yours, Piotr

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there is a big difference between posting a series with different content in each post and posting the same content in two different languages.

I'm on another platform where they will suspend your account if you post duplicate content.

Posting in more than one language is a challenge there is no two ways about that. I think the suggestions here are well made. Post for rewards in one language and post with declined rewards in the other language(s) with notes leading back to the rewarded post so they can get upvoted.

We had a discussion on this topic last week in PYPT. The two column method of posting in two languages was generally well received. It resolves the problem of someone scanning by the post because the first language choice on the post is not in the reader's choice of language.

as for people on blacklists for some people it doesn't matter. I use a browser extension which alerts me when someone is on a blacklist and which one. I will rarely upvote a post that is blacklisted. So following best practices is important.

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Great feedback @shadowspub

We may see things differently, but I value the way you shared your view with me. Respect.

I'm on another platform where they will suspend your account if you post duplicate content.

I wonder if this platform will last very long. Most of the time 'punishing' isn't working. Suspending anybodys account should be kind of illegal. It's like stealing someones investment (after all people invest not only money, but also time and effort).
Downvotes on Steemit proved already, that punishing users with flags has already caused massive amount of users to quit - and to share their awful experience with Steemit (on their other platforms).

ps.
Could you please spare few minutes of your time and have a look at this discussion/proposal that I'm brainstorming with few other guys from "project HOPE"?

Perhaps you would find it worth to join our curation trail. Generally idea is to create a "trigger", which would allow people to join curation trail with their upvote before strong one (300k SP) upvote would follow.
Link: https://steemit.com/steemit/@coach.piotr/project-hope-and-curation-trail-on-steemauto-com-brainstorming

Yours, Piotr

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The other platform is doing just fine after the rule came out. There is a different culture over there. It's more, oh, this is the rule now.. we best adapt if we want to earn. Over here it's more I don't think this is fair so I should throw a fit and threaten to quit.

While the downvoting after HF21/22 was a culture shock for some, I don't believe there was the mass exodus that many claim. There were already many dropping off due to the continued low price. It takes some dedication to stay with a project if it's not meeting your expectations.

I've also seen people returning who had gone inactive and quite happy at the changes on the platform.

As for your curation trail, thank you for the invite but I tend to be very limited on what curation projects I get involved in. I tend to do most of my curating manually.

ShadowsPub
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This post is about my opinion. We can all have our own opinion, it is valid. When talking about communities, when the majority agrees with something you can usually see it, like here.

Stakeholders have the option to agree, for that we have up-votes, or disagree and for that we have down-votes. Only them decide what to do with their stake and there is no rule, but this is a community as well, and sometimes the community decides what is ok and what is not acceptable.

In my view spam is the big nonsense. To try to abuse the reward pool is a big nonsense.

Posted using Partiko Android

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Great feedback @nelyp

I absolutely understand and respect that this post was about your opinion. I figured that you may like to hear other people's opinions too - so I shared mine :)

I appreciate your mature reply.

ps.
I would also like to take this opportunity to share with you one of my recent posts
, where I'm describing project.hope economy (I run it with few guys from steem). I would love, if you could invest few minutes and get familiar with our efforts and perhaps share your feedback (this is what I always care the most).

Yours, Piotr

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It's me again @nelyp

I've just realized that I never actually thanked you for your comment. Big thx.

ps.
I would need to ask you for little favour. Recently I've decided to join small contest called "Community of the week" and I desribed our project.hope hive/community. Would you mind helping me out and RESTEEM this post - just to get some extra exposure? Your valuable comment would be also appreciated.

Link to my post: on steemit or on steempeak

Thanks :)
Yours, Piotr

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@crypto.piotr @shadowspub @nelyp
很高心这里看到你们讨论这个问题.如果只是代表个人观点,我支持你们所有人的不同意见.但如果认为你的观点是社区共识,那就应该写入steem的区块链代码.除此之外的任何机制,我都不认为是合理的.
I'm very glad to see you discuss this issue here. If it's just on behalf of your personal views, I support the different opinions of all of you. But if you think that your views are community consensus, you should write into the blockchain code of steem. I don't think any mechanism other than this is reasonable.

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Hi again @dappcoder

Can I ask you for little favour? I joined contest called "Community of the week" with project I manage and I would be grateful if you could RESTEEM it and help me get some exposure and drop some encouraging comment :)

Link to my post: on steemit or on steempeak

Thanks :)
Yours, Piotr

Hola @nelyp que bueno que hiciste una publicaión sobre el tema, yo misma caí en ese error de hacer publicaciones dobles, por desconocimiento e ignorancia, una vez un amigo me menciono que podia incurrir en una sanción pero no me explico cual era el error, para los nuevos ver blog con publicaciones dobles tal vez no lo veamos feo.

Aunque difiero un poco en el sentido de los idiomas, si una persona habla varios idiomas o usa el traductor, es porque estudió o realizo un poco de esfuerzo por querer llegar a varias masas, con su mismo contenido original, está en el lector votar si le gusto el post en su idioma nativo o en todos, obviamente deberia votar UNA vez, donde leyó y entendio el post.

Pero como las reglas deben existir para regular los comportamientos, tanto en lo virtual como lo real, hay que regirse por ellas.

Interesante saber, que se puede declinar el pago de un post, y colocar el link del primer post original, asi que esta información es de mucha importancia y por lo mismo será reenviado en mi blog.

Muchas gracias, por tomarte el tiempo en difundir buena información y pido disculpas públicamente por repetir post en dos idiomas, no volverá a pasar.

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Como he dicho en otro comentario hace un momento, repostear contenido no está bien visto por la comunidad. Para mi es obvio, en el mismo momento en que te das cuenta de que podrías ser recompensado por lo que posteas, el no reciclar contenido debería ser algo lógico, principalmente por lo la piscina diaria de recompensas, que no es infinita.

Dicho esto, también te digo que entiendo que para un usuario nuevo puede que esto no sea tan obvio, tal vez piensa que el steem de sus recompensas cae del cielo y que al final del día todos posteamos posteamos posteamos, votamos votamos votamos y no pasa nada y las recompensas no varían -> error.

Por eso también es que siempre aconsejo que lean, lean y lean. Y cuando crean que ya lo han leído todo, sigan leyendo. Yo llevo aquí desde 2016 y aún sigo aprendiendo cosas.

Gracias por pasar por aquí y por el comentario :)

Estoy casi totalmente de acuerdo con todo. Pero solo se aborda el caso de escribir! Y que ocurre con los fotógrafos que utilizan la misma foto 2 y 3 veces? O con los ilustradores, o con los músicos, etc. Yo he visto casos: una sesión de fotografías, luego un concurso y luego el retoque de la misma fotografía.
Existe casos de duplicidad de material que al final no es plagio.

A veces cuando leo artículos como estos en steemit me da frustración e indignación.
En mi vida intelectual he leído a autores brillantes (filósofos, escritores, teólogos, etc.) que se citan a sí mismos. Eso no es plagio evidentemente! pero si lo hicieran aquí en steemit entonces resulta que es plagio.

Steemit no tiene alta retención de usuarios sencillamente porque aquí muchos conceptos son contradictorios.
Saludos @nelyp

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A ver tu comentario, se me prenden las alertas que algo esta mal y tenemos que corregirlo. Muy interesante tu punto de vista.

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Gracias por leer mis inquietudes

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Nos tenemos que enfocar en una cosa a la vez. Hay mucho, muchísimo abuso en la plataforma, hemos empezado por esto porque es lo que más vemos últimamente y muchas veces es por desconocimiento. Probablemente más vendrá y tocaremos muchos temas en el futuro. Alguien tiene que decirlo...

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La verdad es que esta publicación es un ejemplo de lo que no me gusta de steemit. La publicación tiene una alta recompensa mientras que otras publicaciones que he leído en la semana, muy interesantes, referente a salud, informática, historia, e ilustraciones han tenido una bajísima remuneración.

Creo que la publicación ha alcanzado los niveles de disertación deseados. Hay muchas contradicciones como señalé anteriormente.

Gracias por responder @nelyp. En Venezuela decimos "hay que aprender a caminar y a masticar chiclets al mismo tiempo". La plataforma de steemit ha evolucionado velozmente y obliga (en el mejor sentido) a los usuarios a estar permanente al día con las innovaciones. Si eso es así... los abusos de la plataforma se deben abordar al mismo tiempo (por cierto me parece que también hay abuso con downvote, por parte de cuentas que no producen 1 publicación, ya lo he comentado anteriormente).

Feliz Semana!

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Los usuarios en esta plataforma up-votan el contenido que les gusta y/o les interesa, lo que no les gusta y/o interesa, no lo votan o lo down-votan. En los dos casos es el usuario el que decide qué hacer y lo mismo se aplica a las publicaciones.

Al ser una red social, por supuesto influyen varios factores más, como en cualquier otra. En Fb o IG mientras más amigos o seguidores tengas, más votos tendrás, aquí es un poco diferente, pero el tiempo que lleves con tu cuenta, la interacción que tengas con otros usuarios, etc... harán que algunos contenidos tengan más alcance que otros. Muchas veces verás temas muy interesantes o de calidad que no están bien remunerados.

He visto que tú interactúas mucho con otros usuarios, eso está genial, no dejes de hacerlo porque es muy, muy importante.

Saludos y feliz semana para tí también :)

Is it ok that a user who happens to know ten different languages, posts the same content ten times?

Yes it is. Doing a translation of a text is a serious job (not considering a Googletrans a real translation) that deserves reward. Users are not obliged to vote for every version. It is expected that those who know a single language would upvote only that text, so no need to decline payout.

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The answer to those questions is, no, it is not ok. And if it's not ok to do it ten times, it's not ok to do it twice.

I know how hard a translation (and I mean a real one) could be, I have done it for this post, and I have people very close to me that have been doing this for a living for a loooong time, so beleive me when I say that I know what I am saying. Still not ok, and is discouraged by the community. Like we said in the post, the reward pool is NOT infinite.

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I have also done translations professionally 8 years. And also know what I am talking about.

Like we said in the post, the reward pool is NOT infinite.

That argument would be valid if the users were FORCED to vote for all translations. And they are not. So I can’t agree with you on this one.

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The thing is, and it's clearly stated in the post, that it is not ME, but the community.

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No it is not, @nelyp. It is your, and I must say wrong INTERPRETATION of the community rules, which says like on your screenshot. Since it is a bit small, and you didn’t left a link to source, I am going to write a transcript here:


Copying and pasting previous posts or significant parts there of could be seen as spam when:

  • Reposting the same content without additional original content or significant changes
  • Reposting content within the same payout window

Spam is discouraged by the community and may result in the account Blacklisted.
Please refrain from copying and pasting previous posts going forward. If you believe this comment is in error, please contact us in #disputes on Discord

You see, reposting content cannot be interpreted the same as reposting translated content. Translating a content in other languages is growing a wider circle of users, and that is good for community. We do all want as much new users as possible, don’t we? Discouraging translations will take more of our reward pool in the long run.

Furthermore… You can send a translation of a shorter texts in the same post. But what will you do when you have a story that fills the limit of 64,000 characters, like this one:

https://steemit.com/literature/@hadzijaz/oni-zhabini

It cannot be translated in the same post even once! And would you think that the one who translates it does not deserve any reward?

And one more point:

Is it ok that a user who happens to know ten different languages, posts the same content ten times?

Translated text IS NOT THE SAME CONTENT. In law, a translation of a poem is considered another artwork. Same with the book translation. It’s a hard work that deserves a reward even for just promoting Steemit in ten other languages, and must not be considered a spam. And especially not among the users of your reputation.

Downvoting should be left to the native speakers who do not consider the translation useful — and they will naturally do it in cases of “googletrans” abuse.

Please, if you have a link to some serious community discussion on this topic, I would like to see it and say a few words.

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No it is not, @nelyp. It is your, and I must say wrong INTERPRETATION of the community rules, which says like on your screenshot.

Again, no, it is not mine and there is not such a rule, but common sense.

Since it is a bit small, and you didn’t left a link to source

The source of that screenshot (a comment left by @steemcleaners) is mentioned quite a bit in this post I think, and no, I am not going to link that to a user blog, as I am not going to point fingers at anyone, that is not the purpose of this post. That comment is easy to find all over this platform unfortunately.

But what will you do when you have a story that fills the limit of 64,000

Option 2.

This post is in Spanish too for a reason, the reason is the abuse we are all seeing lately in the Spanish-speaking community by double posting using google translate.

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Hi @nelyp, @lighteye

I actually fully agree with @lighteye.

It also kind of look, like author of this post is asking people about their opinion and rejecting opinions which are not following his mindset ....

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Very interesting this dissertation

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I'm on the same page @lighteye

If we would assume that same content must be in both languages under just one post, then I wonder shall we say about those people, who are publishing 'series' on some particular topic? You could also tell them that they should pack it all in one publication, instead of breaking one topic into 3-4 posts.

should we also be strict towards those authors and encourage/enforce them to post all their series within one article?

Yours, Piotr

Totally agree with you, especially if you have a lot of autovotes it is very easy to double dip or even multiple dip the rewards pool.

Some will argue that translating to a different language involves work and people should be rewarded for that. Fair comment, but translating your own work to another language requires less effort as you know the article already and you're not creating the content again or not having to read and understand the post like when you're translating somebody else's post as often happens.

!engage 10

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The argument that translating requires work, is something I've read quite a few times as well. The counter-argument is that by translating, you reach a broader audience, and are therefore more likely to recieve additional upvotes which an un-translated post would not.

Of course the more-work-argument falls completely apart when it is quite obvious (in many cases) that the original has simply been run through google translate. Proper translation (or localization) does require work, google does not.

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Dear @johan.norberg

Interesting comment. Thanks for sharing your opinion.

I also wonder would you say about those people, who are publishing 'series' on some particular topic? You could also tell them that they should pack it all in one publication, instead of breaking one topic into 3-4 posts. Kind of nonsense, in my view.

Yours, Piotr

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You are more than welcome.

Thanks for sharing your question, comment and opinion.

Four times.

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Thank you for stopping by and of course, for the tokens too!

The thing is that, most of the time, those users don't even speak the language, and I say this because I know them. For example I am on different discord servers and I can see that they don't know the language at all.. So I am 100% sure that those just copy - paste - there you go, another post in what? One minute máximum? ;)

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Dear @livinguktaiwan

Interesting comment. Thanks for sharing your opinion.

I also wonder would you say about those people, who are publishing 'series' on some particular topic? You could also tell them that they should pack it all in one publication, instead of breaking one topic into 3-4 posts. Kind of nonsense, in my view.

Yours, Piotr

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Very interesting your opinion and very elegant the way to say "I do not agree".

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My issue with all this is mainly around content creation, if you're creating new content for the same topic I see no problem in each being an individual post if the content quality and length warrants it. You can't expect many to read five thousand word post when their feed is filled with so many posts.

Where I'm not keen is people breaking up the post deliberately to meet the minimum word requirement or posting a picture a day, but that's a different issue from the purpose of this post, and is behaviour driven by the nature of that interface/tag/community

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Thanks for sharing your thoughts @livinguktaiwan

Al fin una publicacion que se pueda usar para responder sin dar tantas explicaciones, cuando me pregunten , cuervo por que me dieron downvote y vea que la razon es sencilla al doble posting, enviare tu post!.

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Eres un cuervo muy lazy :P

Básicamente es lo que expliqué en mis tiempos de Sheriff. ¡Muy bien impulsando esto así no hay gente cometiendo errores!

Vale por un unicornio: Haz click aquí para adoptar a este unicornio

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Gracias Vik por pasar por aquí y por el comentario :)

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Hello, I am a cartoonist and I speak Spanish, at the beginning I did it like that, I published in two languages ​​and I was coordinated by () from that moment I understood that what I was doing was a mistake, I corrected it and moved on, it is good to see this publication , so that friends do not make those mistakes, thanks for this information, greetings

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Good that you moved on. Some could see this as something obvious, other users just don't realize, that's why I think this post was needed and I really hope the Spanish-speaking community will read it, understand it and change that (bad) habit.

A mi me cayo 2 veces la gente de steemcleaner porque habia hecho 2 publicaciones con la traduccion en ingles de las 2 publicaciones originales. Y con suerte una buena amiga mia me dijo que no hiciera más eso ya que eso no estaba permitido. Con suerte pude hablar con uno de los curadores de cleaners y lo bueno es que tuve suerte que no me pusieran o no me llegaran a poner en su lista negra (gracias a Dios). Su publicación me ha sido de gran ayuda señorita Nelyp.

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Lo recuerdo, porque te vi haciéndolo y te iba a comentar pero al final se me olvidó (a veces llevo demasiadas cosas a la vez) y cuando me quise dar cuenta ya vi que alguien te había mandado a SC...

Bueno, supongo que deberías quedarte solo con lo bueno de la historia, a veces ciertas cosas malas no lo son tanto, porque nos ayudan a aprender.

Gracias por pasar por aquí :)

For me, when i post in dual language, there's question of which is better. Interleave the 2 languages in different para or one language first follow by another (then which language go first and will images have to be duplicated)

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Personally, I think it's better to have all languages/translations in the same post, starting with the one you think is your main audience. But that is just my personal opinion :)

Good advise, and a really interesting article

Posted using Partiko iOS

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Thank you 😊

interesante, comencé hace poco y tenia esa duda de si se podía o no publicar dos veces el mismo post en diferentes idiomas, al final vi algunos que lo publicaban y no les iba bien (mucho votos negativos) pero como quería publicar en ingles me decidí por ese idioma, no se que tan terrible sea mi ingles pero bueno hay voy.

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Repostear contenido no está bien visto por la comunidad, por razones obvias. Sé y entiendo que los nuevos lo podrían ver normal, teniendo en cuenta que muchos creen que esto es Facebook y postean sus selfies, imagina... jajajaja.

Una información más añadida al disco duro de mi cerebro de cosas que si se puede hacer y cuales no.
Agradecida de la información @nelyp

Posted using Partiko Android

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Hay cosas importantes que se nos escapan, como dice ahí la mayoría de las veces es desconocimiento.
Gracias por pasar por aquí :)

Genial, tu publicación bastante clara, los felicito por agregar valor.

Creo que la razón fuerte acá sería ayudar al ecosistema y poder publicar una sola publicación, ya que solo considera dentro de ese modelo el creador de contenido y no el lector.

Vemos claramente que por tendencia las personas buscan 2 segmentos para poder monetizar con el mismo producto (Contenido) en diferentes idiomas , razones pueden existir muchas, no lo sé

Pensaré como puedo ayudar en mejorar esta variante dentro del sistema de steemit.

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La razón es, en la mayoría de los casos, lo que has dicho, monetizar con el mismo producto.
Gracias por pensar en intentar ayudar al ecosistema, será un bien para todos :)

Hola @nelyp

interesante publicación, yo creo que siempre se puede publicar en varios idiomas sin necesidad de declinar el pago, aquí lo que importa es sumar valores agregados de un idioma a otra; y eso añade calidad. Si se agregan aforismos, chistes, información adicional de un idioma a otro, inclusive gente de diferentes lenguajes se van a interesar en leer o aprender la información que esta en un idioma diferente al suyo.
En este sentido me parece importante que se haga.
Buena publicación, controversial e interesante, te felicito.

Posted using Partiko Android

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Muchas gracias por la visita y por el comentario :)

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De nada 💖, siempre es un placer apoyar las publicaciones que generan positiva controversia y buen ruido 👍

the reward pool isn't so much shared as it is allocated by stakeholders

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Yes, but that I think is a different discussion ;)

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Tell me more about your point.

Great post with explanation and solutions for those that may not have known better.

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Thanks for the comment :)

Esta publicación ha sido seleccionada para el reporte de Curación Diaria.

final de post.png¡¡¡Felicidades!!!



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Initially I agreed with what was raised by the author of this post.

But after reading the reflections of @crypto.piotr and @lighteye, I think that not everything raised here should be taken as a rule that should be applied.

I've always wondered about steemcleaners and other accounts like jaguar.force, who gave them that authority to judge and set standards and policies?

But back to the main topic. I think that the fact of publishing the translation of a previous post should not be considered a fault, nor should it be a reason for downvotes and/or inclusion in any blacklist.

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Yes, some can agree, disagree or change their opinion, like you did.

We don't have rules, that word you are not going to read it from me. What we do have is a community and an ecosystem to take care of and use with responsibility. We decide what to do and how to act, no one else.

Posted using Partiko Android

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What we do have is a community and an ecosystem to take care of and use with responsibility.

Totally agree.
We will achieve this with a high level of tolerance and being very sensible.

hola @nelyp saludos desde Venezuela me ha llamado la atención tu articulo, sabes mi opinión al respecto es algo diferente, hay libros que tienen múltiples traducciones, considero que va dirigido a públicos totalmente diferentes (razon suficiente para mi para no considerarlo spam), simplemente si yo no entiendo algún idioma diferente al mio hago caso omiso al articulo, pero porsupuesto entiendo y respeto las normativas y el punto de vista del resto ;) te deseo una feliz noche

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¡Saludos, trompetista! Sí, opiniones hay varias, esta es la mía y la de parte de la comunidad, algunos también están de acuerdo con lo que dices. En definitiva, la comunidad es quien decidirá qué es aceptable y qué no.

Esto está claro que no es una editorial. Recuerdo hace tiempo una escritora famosa (en la plataforma) que publicaba lo que vendría a ser una página del libro a diario. Al principio tuvo buena aceptación y le votaban. A partir de un punto los usuarios se dieron cuenta de el libro entero estaba saliendo ya muy caro al ecosistema y se lo hicieron saber, tanto en comentarios como en (no) votos.

En fin, es solo un ejemplo y como digo, la comunidad decidirá.

Gracias por pasar por aquí :)

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Hi, I was brought here by @juanmolina so I gave your article a look. I think there are moments, where two separate posts work fine. Let me say a few things.

The title in English and/or in a different language - it is then too long and people ALWAYS look at the first words and if they see some different language, they are not interested anymore.

The length of the article - when there is some short article, it is essential to use two language versions in one article. Otherwise it is too bad for the group, who read the article "in the bottom". They might skip whole article, because they will firstly see the text only in the beginning. Okay, you can separate to two columns. But then it is even longer for both.

And when someone uses proper translation (not just google translator version), it is quite ok because the person put some effort even to the second article.

So in my view, it is not easy to look on this topic. You should take respect from other perspectives. Surely, this is your opinion and there is nothing bad about it. But I rather look on this from the user experience point of view. That is, in my opinion, the most important. Otherwise, downvoting armies would have nothing to downvote in the future. Just saying.

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Thank you @ritxi for stopping by and for the comment :)

I think it is ok to translate, some times. If you post daily one version in one language and a second one in a different language, I see it as a form of abuse, especially if that second post, the translation, is a copy paste from google translate.

Finally, I DO respect other perspectives, opinions, etc. I can agree or not, just like others can with me, but that's a different thing.

Gracias por el articulo, esta muy interesante. Tampoco me agrada ver un mismo artículo en uno o varios idiomas al mismo tiempo solo para ganar dinero por las votaciones. En lo personal prefiero publicar en mi idioma materno, no se si steemit permita colocar enlaces para traducir automáticamente un artículo.

Muy buena tu explicación y sería bien tomar en cuenta este error. Hay algo de lo que quiero saber y no se dónde buscar información. Es acerca de los tantos hive...... que existen ahora en Steemit y me gustaría saber para qué se utiliza cada uno. Gracias por tu post de información.

Interesante posteo en un tema que puede ser un foco de discusiones.

Comparto la opinión de que si hay intensiones de hacer un determinado trabajo, se haga en un solo posteo multilenguaje.